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National Team Debate Thread (thread closed)

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This Post:
00
303114.14 in reply to 303114.11
Date: 02/27/2020 20:15:57
Tunjevina
III.4
Overall Posts Rated:
543543
Second Team:
Krompir
No it's not ok to share the skills of NT players as NT manager with the staff of other countries or managers which are not part of the own staff.

NT managers have always shared the skills of players with their community, not just with their staff members. It's a great way to interest the community into this game, and help people with training, especially if they're new.
Staff members of a NT aren't an official bb position and they change frequently anyway.

I would understand a rule if a NT manager isn't allowed to share player skills with NT managers from other countries even if both parties agree, but if so, it should be written in the game manual. I've read the game manual for the National Teams before making such a suggestion, but it wasn't there.

This Post:
00
303114.15 in reply to 303114.12
Date: 02/27/2020 20:26:46
TIP IN Berlin ´96
III.9
Overall Posts Rated:
35673567
Second Team:
BERLIN KNICKS

Serbia has an online database that you can find on our NT page, but of course you can't access it. If I get elected, I would give access to that database to a select few German staff members, and once my term ends, they would be restricted from seeing it again.


I also think it´s not a good moment to present a candidature when both teams play in the same group.


100% my point of view. I agree with what Wendell said about the foreign candidate, but when both countries are in the same group, this alone is reason enough for me not to vote for him. Furthermore I´m not pleased with the idea of giving NT-Skillsets away, that should never happen. And its not allowed like we learned a few posts ago. So for me there is no way to share skillsets with whoever.

Scout for the german U-21 & NT team -------------------------------------------------------- S38/39 U-21-coach Misr/Egypt ------------------------------------------------------------------ S38 african championship semi finalist & WR from 95 to 70 with a bunch of scrubs! ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 20 seasons in a row german III.9
This Post:
00
303114.16 in reply to 303114.12
Date: 02/27/2020 20:28:26
Tunjevina
III.4
Overall Posts Rated:
543543
Second Team:
Krompir
I wouldn't force anyone to be a part of it. I'm sure some would be interested to see the skills of Serbian players, but your GM isn't allowing it, so it won't happen.
I promise not to share German skills to anyone, but I understand if you don't trust me, since from your perspective, those words are coming from a stranger.

Even if Serbia and Germany weren't in the same group, no one could guarantee that the two nations wouldn't meet at a later stage.
Polish manager managing Lietuva managed to beat Poland in the World Cup Final (46989). So, such games happen sometimes, and of course I wouldn't run for your NT manager if I didn't want to win in every game, regardless of who the opponent is.

This Post:
11
303114.17 in reply to 303114.16
Date: 02/28/2020 03:46:49
NakamichiDragons
II.4
Overall Posts Rated:
18161816
Second Team:
Little Computer People
… Even if Serbia and Germany weren't in the same group, no one could guarantee that the two nations wouldn't meet at a later stage. ...


But they are and that's why your candidature is ill-timed for me.

I'm not that much concerned about sharing skills since the players are on the market from time to time.

founded in S3 IV.5 (34234) - returned in S28 IV.7 (34515)
This Post:
11
303114.18 in reply to 303114.17
Date: 02/28/2020 05:06:00
Hamburg Albatrosses
III.5
Overall Posts Rated:
82128212
Second Team:
Korean S. Fighters
But not all players are on the TL. My SF and possible future NT trainee won’t be on the list. There has been a website that collected all skillsets from the TL in the past and people were able to subscribe, pay some money and see those skills. And there BB intervened. This is strictly forbidden.

I have issues with sharing our skills with other nations. If you get elected, you’re welcome of course to use your knowledge of the serbian NT players. Because you have it and you decided yourself to run in this election. But why should we agree with sharing our database with another country? What would be our gain? Nothing! Maybe for you because they would still like you over there since you gave them some information.

Thank you for running again. And also thank you for being honest about your intentions. It was really hard for me to decide between you and Falke because I think you‘re both good managers and it‘s always good to have new ideas and some fresh energy on the team. But this point definitely decided the election (for me). So thanks again, but like this it‘s not going to work - and I‘m pretty sure I‘m not the only one thinking like this...

Du hast nicht genug Geld, um dieses Gebot abzugeben!
This Post:
11
303114.19 in reply to 303114.14
Date: 02/28/2020 14:06:58
Essen Eagles
III.16
Overall Posts Rated:
76697669
Second Team:
Huttrop Hornets
I would understand a rule if a NT manager isn't allowed to share player skills with NT managers from other countries even if both parties agree, but if so, it should be written in the game manual. I've read the game manual for the National Teams before making such a suggestion, but it wasn't there.


It's not written like many other things like e.g. sabotage of a player of other countries (a team of another country buys a NT player and then doesn't train him and gives him no minutes in the game to weaking the other NT).

When I would train a player and invest money and time to get him in the National team and to have a very strong top player in my league and then the NT manager would share his skills with other players outside his own staff then I would be realy pissed off !

The most important thing in my eyes is the trust of the community in the NT manager and his staff, because both share the skills of cause but the managers of the players rely on the safty of that data.


This Post:
11
303114.20 in reply to 303114.18
Date: 02/28/2020 18:55:58
Tunjevina
III.4
Overall Posts Rated:
543543
Second Team:
Krompir
All I offered was a suggestion, since people brought up the trust issue, which is understandable. There is no need for people to get so defensive about it.
It was my intention to build trust by giving you an alternative, nothing more, and it backfired on me.

I wouldn't do anything that wasn't mutually agreed on. Hope you understand that.

This Post:
44
303114.21 in reply to 303114.19
Date: 02/28/2020 19:31:18
Tunjevina
III.4
Overall Posts Rated:
543543
Second Team:
Krompir
When I would train a player and invest money and time to get him in the National team and to have a very strong top player in my league and then the NT manager would share his skills with other players outside his own staff then I would be realy pissed off !

It used to be like that in Serbia too. Only few staff members knew NT player skills. We won 1 medal in more than 20 seasons, and it was Bronze.

Then we decided to make a change, and access to our database was given to anyone who wants to see it and is training potential NT players. In the next 20 seasons, we won 10 medals, 4 of which were Gold.
The interest in training NT players increased exponentially, and managers were able to understand much better how to train their players.
The overall quality of managers improved, which showed in club competitions as well.

It seems our communities think differently. No one in Serbia ever complained that the skills of their NT player can be viewed by other managers. It's quite the opposite. We managed to build a sense of belonging and trust among us. Even managers who never trained NT players, started training them. We worked towards the same goal, and everyone felt that they're part of the staff, and in a sense they were.

It also solved one other issue that we used to have. NT managers would often defend their poor results by simply saying that the team wasn't good enough. Since people didn't knew player skills, they couldn't judge for themselves if that is true, or if the results are underachieving.

Probably all other Div I managers know the skills of my Elakovic, even though I drafted him and he was never on a TL. Am I pissed off about it? Of course not. I'm proud of training such a beast, and I'm happy to get emails from managers asking me about his training.
Knowing an opponent player's skills can be helpful, but is in no way crucial, and much less important then what you're implying it to be.

This Post:
66
303114.22 in reply to 303114.21
Date: 02/29/2020 07:43:31
Hammond Hammers
III.4
Overall Posts Rated:
107107
I think your last posting said it all. There is next to zero disadvantage in sharing top players skills. But anyhow, hope you were not too surprised about this introduction to the german perspective on data and privacy. We are a very secretive kind when it comes to online data, regardless if we talk bank account info or meaningless datasets of players in an online game. I'm sure most people don't mean anything bad by rejecting you, it's just part of their habits.
I for one have voted for you. I think you are by far the best coach we can get atm and our own definitely did not cover themselves in glory over the past few seasons. Eventhough our team and community has made great strives towards a better national team and community feeling.

This Post:
11
303114.24 in reply to 303114.21
Date: 02/29/2020 08:57:23
Hamburg Albatrosses
III.5
Overall Posts Rated:
82128212
Second Team:
Korean S. Fighters
Thanks for explaining your point of view, it definitely makes more sense looking at it from this perspective! Would you set up a new database? Because our database (being a forum) isn‘t the best for giving everyone access...

Just trying to look at it from your point of view and pointing out possible difficulties. And Kwatsch might have nailed it with his comment. He might be right, but I guess for building trust it takes some time...but you‘re definitely being honest about what you‘re planning to do. So I guess that‘s a good start, regardless if you win the election or not...

Du hast nicht genug Geld, um dieses Gebot abzugeben!
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