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U21 National Team Debate Thread (thread closed)

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From: Fwinns

To: FurY
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299225.6 in reply to 299225.4
Date: 5/9/2019 4:46:15 PM
V.A.W.T.
II.4
Overall Posts Rated:
299299
Fair enough, thanks, good luck!

This Post:
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299225.10 in reply to 299225.9
Date: 5/9/2019 9:25:22 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
109109
Getting from 15 to 17 ID is probably a 4 to 5 week adventure depending on the sublevels of the player's ID inside of 15.

Getting a player with say 1 Pa to 2 Pa will almost always take just 1 week. Getting a player from 2 to 3 will also almost always take just 1 week. Getting a player to 4 usually will take 2, unless the sublevels are low Or the HA/DR of the player are very low. So it's almost always benificial to get those first few, which is why i think a 1 in PA is only something you see when a manager is unwilling to train his player out of position (which can happen, not everyone likes to do that when they are doing their local club winning).

The ukraine u21 manager choosing 17 ID in many situations is not wrong. Against teams at the peak of talent in europe, you will find some 18-19 IS monsters there with just the basic training on their secondaries (they mostly will pick players that start with good secondaries, or a guard skill point total north of 25. In order for the Ukraine not to get beat against those teams, a player with more than 15 ID can be quite vital to shutting down the inside threat. It's more important perhaps than a well rounded player. However, it can be quite a bit of overkill when you face other teams that are mid level or lower in europe and have players with 13 or less IS. So again, it's really just a question of what you think you need.

As far as u21 versus NT development, while it is true that the NT would not start passing training until well after age 21, not all u21 starters need 12 passing, and in some cases playing a funnel approach to one target can be detrimental if he has high passing. I think an average SF passing of 9-10 is ideal, and depending on which style of offense you have for the game, it can be the same for the SG or slightly lower. extra PA on a SG is nice in look inside and more important even in low post which slows down tactics for quality shots. Only a handful of players are going to have trained PA quite early, and most of them are 7 potential players that cannot become long term threats for their clubs because of poor starting inside skills.

This Post:
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299225.12 in reply to 299225.11
Date: 5/13/2019 7:20:42 PM
V.A.W.T.
II.4
Overall Posts Rated:
299299
He explained last season that he prefer not to use scrimmage as it gives data to your opponents (valid argument there although there are also advantages to play scrimmages)

From: FurY

This Post:
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299225.13 in reply to 299225.12
Date: 5/13/2019 11:44:37 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
109109
The advantages of a scrimmage is you get to see players in action against similar talent, assuming you find the right team and the right situation in which the other side is willing to field a somewhat standard u21 setup.

The disadvantages of a scrimmage is that most people will run 1-off strategies into one another, and the end result does not necessarily benefit you as a coach because you do not effectively know if your team defensively is good against an LI or LP when you faced a princeton or outside isolation.

While i am willing to take on a scrimmage against the right team, i've not once really been offered a scrim worth taking in the 6 seasons now that i've been in charge of a u21 team. I'd have taken one as the US manager when Cletus was the canadian u21 manager if we could mutually agree to run something we could both benefit from, and i would equally be interested with the US u21 team in the same format now. Furthermore, any other u21 team that is at or better than the Canadian u21 in terms of talent that is willing to negotiate a specific playtsyle i would be open to.


This Post:
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299225.14 in reply to 299225.13
Date: 5/14/2019 12:02:56 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
883883
Did someone say Cletus?

I've been in BB hibernation. Semi-out of it now and on the fence whether to go back to sleep or wake up and work to get back to Naismith.